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  #21  
Old September 20th, 2012, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ncgolferette View Post
Great to know about the CDC website. I have bookmarked it for future reference.
Me too, great to have. I'm very glad I don't have a cruise booked on the Veendam right now.
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  #22  
Old September 20th, 2012, 12:39 PM
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I've bookmarked the site as well.

I find this whole issue with the Veendam very sad as she was my first cruise ship, and got me addicted to cruising However, I am feeling increasingly uneasy about maintenance right across the fleet. It's not just the occasional problems that come up, but HQ's consistent responses that there's never been a problem before, and there seems to be no resolution to any of them, on any of the ships, all the while the problems are being reported here over many cruises.

Yesterday, DH and I were at Canada Place in Vancouver and checking out the Volendam - my all-time favourite ship - and he noted how shabby she is looking. Hoping she gets spruced up soon but maybe someone who has recently been on her can attest that all is well onboard.
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  #23  
Old September 20th, 2012, 12:56 PM
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Obviously with all the comments here over the months this is not good for the Veendam and the Rotterdam, while certainly not as bad, just adds a little salt to the wound so to speak. That said my concern is the bigger issue of HAL leadership and management. Letting this happen is one concern I have and maybe more importantly is what happens now.
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  #24  
Old September 20th, 2012, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luvtravel View Post
I'm not buying that. HAL's ads say luxury cruising! There is no excuse for not providing a clean ship for passengers. Unfortunately I have reservations for next week on this ship...so disappointed. I am calling travel agent today to tell them about this....think they need also to not sell or at least be aware of this inferior product.
Wife and I are booked for 13 day South American dep Nov 11. Obviously we are concerned. Could we ask you for updates after you are aboard. It looks as though a cancellation is not possible.

Last edited by Brookfield13615; September 20th, 2012 at 12:58 PM.
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  #25  
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:16 PM
CtheW0rld CtheW0rld is offline
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Originally Posted by Brookfield13615 View Post
Wife and I are booked for 13 day South American dep Nov 11. Obviously we are concerned. Could we ask you for updates after you are aboard. It looks as though a cancellation is not possible.
welcome to CC. you are correct, too late to cancel now (unless you bought cancel for any reason insurance). go and enjoy your cruise. chance are everything will be fine for you.
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  #26  
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:17 PM
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It is never too late to cancel..... it is a question of whether you are willing to forfeit funds. Most of us, of course, do not wish to do that.

Were we to be on a ship that we found intolerable with malfunctioning toilet for days on end, a cabin without air condtioning, and an assortment of other issues, we would leave and go home. The money has been spent anyway but we would decide if we should put up with unhealthy, intolerable conditions on our 'luxury' vacation.

When Maasdam cancelled four ports on our seven day second part of our b-to-b, Boston to Montreal to Boston, several years ago and returned to Boston two days early, we left.

As soon as the ship was cleared, we went home. We did not seek nor did we receive any refund for those unused days and the hurricane never came to Boston but we were not going to ride out the storm tied up to a dock in Boston when we live nearby. We forfeited the money we had paid for those days and never asked for anything.





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  #27  
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:36 PM
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What an embarrassment! Those booked on the Veendam and wishing to cancel might check to see if Holland America will do the right thing and waive cancellation fees. It does not hurt to ask.
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  #28  
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:52 PM
ivoryboi ivoryboi is offline
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Veendam went into Code Red 3 days ago. Expect late embarkation in Boston this Saturday.
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  #29  
Old September 20th, 2012, 01:54 PM
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When a resturant gets a bad review, they close the doors until it is cleaned up but it appears that HAL just kept right on sailing. Isn't there something they must do to protect the pax on the next and the next and next sailing date?
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  #30  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:18 PM
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Default and HAL has other problems

Just to put this in context, a whole boatload of HAL cheerleaders jumped up and down attempting to defend the line and disparage the CDC last month when this came up on an earlier thread.

Until Veendam, ...... Rotterdam had scored worse than any other ship from a major cruise line. Any score below 85 is considered unsatisfactory.

Rotterdam was a borderline 86.

Rotterdam -- 86
Veendam -- previously 93 -- now with a failing 77
Zaandam -- 93
Amsterdam -- 94
Maasdam -- 95
Westerdam -- 95
Ryndam -- 97
Prinsendam -- 98
Statendam -- 98
Noordam -- 99
Oosterdam -- 99
Volendam -- 99
Zuiderdam -- 99
Eurodam -- 100
Nieuw Amsterdam -- 100

Since Jan 1, 2012, a total of 25 ships have scored 100. HAL has two.
The only ship (until Veendam) to rate lower than Rotterdam this year was the MV Yorktown, a 138-passenger ship on the Great Lakes, rated filthiest at 74.
Only one other ship scored 86 -- tied with Rotterdam for second worst -- the Caribbean Fantasy. No other ships scored below 90. (until Veendam)
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  #31  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:20 PM
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I am a little confused about this. The CDC fails a ship and proceeds to let it sail. If the you fail the health department test here they shut you down. This was the perfect opportunity to get the problems fixed. All the CDC has to say is the ship is not sailing until you pass your inspection. This would have gotten HAL's attention quickly and I am guessing numerous problems resolved. Why have teh inspection if there is no teeth to it.

So the majority of the PAX who do not follow CC have no clue about the problems but the agency that is responsible for passenger safety fails the ship and then let's it sail on. This does not make alot of sense to me. Why bother with the inspection anyway.
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  #32  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Krazy Kruizers View Post
I just read over over the citations -- somthing like 120??

It is hard to believe that in April 2012 -- just 4 months before -- she got a 93.
That is amazing. I know that when we were on board the week of May 6, we didn't have any problems nor did we hear of anyone. It is truly hard to believe it could go downhill in such a short amount of time.
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  #33  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voyageur9 View Post
Just to put this in context, a whole boatload of HAL cheerleaders jumped up and down attempting to defend the line and disparage the CDC last month when this came up on an earlier thread.

Until Veendam, ...... Rotterdam had scored worse than any other ship from a major cruise line. Any score below 85 is considered unsatisfactory.

Rotterdam was a borderline 86.

Rotterdam -- 86
Veendam -- previously 93 -- now with a failing 77
Zaandam -- 93
Amsterdam -- 94
Maasdam -- 95
Westerdam -- 95
Ryndam -- 97
Prinsendam -- 98
Statendam -- 98
Noordam -- 99
Oosterdam -- 99
Volendam -- 99
Zuiderdam -- 99
Eurodam -- 100
Nieuw Amsterdam -- 100

Since Jan 1, 2012, a total of 25 ships have scored 100. HAL has two.
The only ship (until Veendam) to rate lower than Rotterdam this year was the MV Yorktown, a 138-passenger ship on the Great Lakes, rated filthiest at 74.
Only one other ship scored 86 -- tied with Rotterdam for second worst -- the Caribbean Fantasy. No other ships scored below 90. (until Veendam)
Actually Salicia reminded us on the other Veendam thread that the Queen Mary failed in 2011. So other ships have scored below 90.

Here's her post (copied and pasted) " All hell broke lost when Queen Mary 2 shockingly failed inspection with a score of 84 in June, 2011. (Scores of 85 or lower are failures.) http://wwwn.cdc.gov/InspectionQueryT...cztPHHPwYEA%3d

Happily, QM2 scored 100 on the last two inspections. Here's hoping the Veendam can follow suit and get it's act cleaned up. -S
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  #34  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:42 PM
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That miserable 77 score primarily reflects the condition of things that the average cruiser never sees.

Some of these unsatisfactory conditions relate directly to the health and well being of the crew and passengers.

I am surprised that the news outlets have not picked this up. It is definitely newsworthy.

HAL Corporate senior management and the Veendam management team should hang their collective heads in shame.

I hope that CDC follows this up shortly with another audit and that the results have improved to at least a passing grade.

Last edited by iancal; September 20th, 2012 at 02:43 PM.
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  #35  
Old September 20th, 2012, 02:59 PM
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well, salacia, if the truth made you laugh, i'm happy. at least you did not deny anything i said; but you can, of course. that would make me laugh, also.
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  #36  
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Laminator View Post
I am a little confused about this. The CDC fails a ship and proceeds to let it sail. If the you fail the health department test here they shut you down. This was the perfect opportunity to get the problems fixed. All the CDC has to say is the ship is not sailing until you pass your inspection. This would have gotten HAL's attention quickly and I am guessing numerous problems resolved. Why have teh inspection if there is no teeth to it.

<snip>

You say '".... here they shut you down" .........

I'm curious. Where is here?
Thanks.

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Last edited by sail7seas; September 20th, 2012 at 03:18 PM.
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  #37  
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by sail7seas View Post
You say '".... here they shut you down" .........

I'm curious. Where is here?
Thanks.

I don't know where LAMINATOR is, but here in Athens the Health Department can and has closed restaurants where customers were eating. If the inspection show that there is a definite, current, hazard it can happen.
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  #38  
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:23 PM
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At some point the captain and hotel manager must take responsibility for this.

I know the captain on our sailing (when this report was filed, actually) - does anyone know the other Veendam captain?

Makes sense a major shake up is needed. And now I know why the crew are praying to get out if their contract; they are working in miserable, insanitary conditions for bosses who clearly don't care.

Makes me SO ANGRY to think of those poor crew members so far from home with zero recourse at all.
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  #39  
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
I don't know where LAMINATOR is, but here in Athens the Health Department can and has closed restaurants where customers were eating. If the inspection show that there is a definite, current, hazard it can happen.


Yes, Health Department has done the same in Boston and our local city, as well, for the same reasons.

I'm not sure Laminator is necessarily from U.S.
I am wondering if from another country where ship inspection failure denies the ship the ability to board her guests and sail. Can/do they have that power and do they exercise it in Canada, does anyone know?

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Last edited by sail7seas; September 20th, 2012 at 03:42 PM.
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  #40  
Old September 20th, 2012, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sail7seas View Post
Yes, Health Department has done the same in Boston and our local city, as well, for the same reasons.

I'm not sure Laminator is necessarily from U.S.
I am wondering if from another country where ship inspection failure denies the ship the ability to board her guests and sail. Can/do they have that power and do they exercise it in Canada, does anyone know?
Sorry, I don't know about Canada, but here's the rules in the US (I posted this on a different thread earlier, so please forgive the repeat for those who have already read it.)

Quoted from http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/about_inspections.htm
What happens if a ship fails an inspection?

Ships that fail inspections are re-inspected within a reasonable time period of the failure. If a ship fails an inspection because of an imminent public health risk, VSP may recommend that the ship not sail. Imminent public health risks include the following violations:
  • inability to properly chlorinate potable water;
  • inability to keep food within safe temperatures;
  • inadequate facilities for cleaning and sanitizing equipment;
  • inability to properly dispose of solid or liquid waste; and
  • an infectious disease outbreak where continuing normal operations may subject newly arriving passengers to disease.
Approximately two thousand passengers, many without seating, were waiting inside and outside the cruise terminal in NYC while boarding was delayed for several hours the day the last published inspection was carried out on 18 August. I can only imagine the mayhem that would have ensued had the ship not been permitted to finally board the waiting passengers; my guess is that step is rarely taken. Regards, S.

Edited to add: It just dawned on me that the Captain and others must have know that the ship failed inspection. I would have thought that they would have been extra vigilant after that, but I'm sorry to say that from what I witnessed, was not the case on the Aug 18 Veendam cruise.

Last edited by Salacia; September 20th, 2012 at 03:42 PM.
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